Answer 46

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Question 46

What level of toleration do we want/expect between atheists and theists?

I expect people to generally be nice to each other and mind their own business. Also, I expect to be treated as an individual and I work damn hard to do likewise. (Todd Adamson #1114)

The highest possible while preserving the "don't poke your rules into MY life!" distance. They don't try to make my children pray, they don't knock on my door with "good news", I won't try to disabuse them of their delusions. (Victor A. Danilchenko #696)

If theists come in and ask questions, they should be answered civilly. If theists ask questions about the answers, they should be answered civilly. If theists argue the answers based on buybull or cretinist publications, they should be lined up against a wall and shot. Well, either that, or given references to straighten them out. If theists ignore the references and/or continue to spew forth their nonsense, then I won't blame or castigate anyone who chooses to go on to -- what's the word? -- more, uhm, blatant methods of getting them to shut up and/or go away. (Magyckme #554)

This falls into the: If you stay out of my face I'll stay out of yours category. But as we all know in practice many/most theists find this hard to do, as they want every one to live by their set of particular fantasies. (Gully Foyle #23)

I'm not sure that toleration is the correct word. I would want the differences between theists and atheists to become non-issues. I want freedom from coercion, either legally or societally, to participate in other peoples fantasies. Unfortunately, I find that many xians subscribe to the judgmental dogma, "If you are not for us, you are against us."

What I expect, based on my past experiences, is not so optimistic. I expect the present "us vs. them" mentality to continue as a means to enforce certain political and social agenda which are deemed to promote 'biblical' or "family' values. I expect to continue to fight those who consider the teaching of evolution in public schools to be an abomination. I expect that the subjective reliance on religious faith to provide the "answers" will be still considered "normal" and that a repudiation of the supernatural will still be feared. (Liz Huth #658)

I have no problem with the 90% or so theists who mind their own business. What I want/expect from that other 10% is for them to do the same. This includes a cessation of attempts to rewrite Gawd into the D.of I./Bill of Rights, same for inflicting mandated prayer in public schools, crosses on county/state/fed land, etc. Since I am supposed to have freedom of religion, I shouldn't have to accept ANY pressure from people trying to make me follow THEIR beliefs. Basically the only situation I would find totally acceptable is for theists to keep their religion to themselves, in their homes and churches, not in the work place or even in the public. I get offended when some theist asshole approaches me in a mall, shoves a tract in my face, and asks if I've been saved. My desire is to pound the shit out of them on the spot, but lucky for them I'm lawabiding. I don't think that anyone should have to put up with this type of public abuse. (Bob Henderson #8)

Want: I would be happy if they followed the golden rule of 'do unto others'... I mean, if I walked from house to house handing out atheist or pagan pamphlets then I could understand the Mormons getting me out of bed at 7am. I, like many others in here, don't give a flying *boink* about what anyone sees as their 'higher power.' I may see it as silly, but I only make that point to people who make an issue out of it, pushing it where it isn't wanted. One of my best friends is a fairly fundie Seventh Day Adventist, and we get along fine simply because she doesn't make it the central fact of everything in her life. She is capable of talking about something without bringing the Bible into it constantly, for no real reason. Sure, there's the occasional "thank God" here and there, but for the most part we have a relationship between two people, not two ideologies. I could WISH that some of the people who come in here, preach on TV and/or bribe politicians were as emotionally mature, but I don't see that happening any time soon. It's always going to be 'US' and 'THEM', never just people. Christian and heathen, black and white, north and south, etc.

Expect: I have come to expect almost anything... The depths of some people's depravity never fails to amaze me. For the most part I expect to be looked at as a second rate human being... A soiled soul that should be separated from the saved, divine, holy, righteous, etc. until forcefull converted, lest I spread my filth like a plague onto their children. Beyond that I have been spit on (when coming out of an occult bookstore), had my life threatened (my high school job, while delivering several boxes of stationary to an abortion clinic... not to mention all the internet threats I've gotten from a wide variety of sick people), and been severely beaten by what was essentially a redneck Baptist street gang for God. I could expect more of them, but everyone knows the faithful have no morals. :) (Satin)

A few years ago one of my nephews married. He and his future wife chose for a catholic wedding. As a close family member who had always been on good terms, I was invited to the service.
Now the custom here is that a wedding service is largely written by the wedding couple. Those that attend, get a little booklet that describes the service and indicates, where the public/vistors are supposed to fall in. This ususally contains paragraphs were the family and friends give their support to the couple.
To my dismay I found that each and every paragraph contained an expression of faith. I didn't mind that the couple itself expressed their faith. This was their day, I wouldn't have mind if some of the public paragraphs had contained expressions of faith. But that all of them did gave me the feeling of being left out. In this whole ceremony I didn't have a single chance to give my support to the couple, because they were so interleaved with expressions of faith that it wouldn't mean anything to me, Like: "I will pray to the holy God to support this young couple".
The reason that I was annoyed, was that the couple knew they had invited non-believers. Non-believers who were close friends and close family. Yet in this whole ceremony they hadn't provideded the smallest opening for these people to give a whole-hearted support.
In my opinion it would have been like being a vegetarian, being invited by a lover of meat to a party. But you know the host knows you are a vegetarian and has invited other friends and family that are vegetarians too. Yet when arrive you find out not a single course is prepared with the considerations that vegetarinans are invited. The vegetarians have only the choice in eating nothing or in trying to accomodate themselves as best as possible but probably eat some meat in the process.
IMO when you invite friends and relatives to something you want to share with them you should leave enough of an opeing to allow them the possibility to share. That is what I would want more. That people when inviting friends for something they want to share, leave more opportunities for friends of a different lean- ing to really share. (Antoon Pardon #87)

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