Answer187

	Sign In Sign-Up

Answer187

Question187

How do you answer theists who say, "Someday something bad will happen to you and you'll find/pray to God."?

I answer them: "Many bad things have already happened to me, and I was able to handle them without help, thanks much. I know some people need that religious crutch to lean on."

I get puzzled looks, oddly. (Grace #1752)

"Something bad is happening right now, and I'm praying you'll go away."

But seriously folks....

This is just another wording of the "no atheists in foxholes" myth. A person of strong character won't fall back on magical fairies, he/she will suck it up and carry on. Bad things happen to everybody, but the worst thing one can do is hope somebody else will take care of it. It's the weak willed that abdicate their responsibility and call it a "show of faith".

Gary Gaetti, major league ballplayer and "born again xian" once said after committing an error in a playoff game (his error cost his team the pennant), "I guess that's what god wanted to happen". No willingness to take responsibility, no character to admit to his own blunder, just an attempt to avoid blame by claiming it was the work of a "higher power" with a "purpose".

Bill Buckner made a similar error in the 1986 and the Boston Red Sox lost their best chance since 1918 to win the World Series, but Buckner didn't hide behind "god". Okay, he hid from the media for a few weeks, but he had the guts to later admit it was his mistake. And no, he didn't try to blame it on the "curse of the Bambino" either. It's interesting that Buckner never flogged his religion during his career.

Also interesting are how many ballplayers' careers falter after they "find god" - Gaetti, Andy Pettite, Orel Hershiser, etc. It almost seems "god" causes the tough times instead of solving them. (Bob Dog #153)

Ya know, when I was sixteen I flew from the passenger seat out the back windshield of a car into some trees. After it happened, I was like "Damn, maybe I need to start going to Church." Needless to say, I never did end up going to Church nor have I ever to this day. And so to this question, I'm not sure what I'd answer. Perhaps I'd answer that "Hey, If 'God' saved me, an agnostic, from dying in that car accident then maybe he doesn't mind us agnostics and atheists after all" ;) (Jen)

I would answer that, when I was twenty-one, I was suffering from a long-standing, undiagnosed case of chronic depression that eventually led to an unsuccessful (i.e., aborted) suicide attempt. Neither in the period leading up to the attempt, nor during the attempt, nor in the long period of recovery after the attempt did I find any use for notion of prayer. I dare say that if *that* experience doesn't constitute something sufficiently bad to compell me to pray, then I can't imagine what sort of circumstance would suffice to drive me to such a desperate state that I would feel there was any benifit to be had in petitioning some sort of supernatural agent to intervene in my life. (Andrerw Lias)

Read the question about an hour ago, and apart from reading it above, its never happened yet. Sounds a very spiteful sort of a threat. I mean.... do you get a choice in any of this? Can this GOD give you back time? So what's the plea?
Less pain?
GOD has to bargain with us?
Hmmmm perhaps I'd better leave it at that. There's too many ways I could take it further. (Kerry #1773)

There are so many things to say that it is hard to know where to begin.

First, I can point out that something bad has already happened to me; it would be a charmed life indeed if at my age nothing bad had every happened. And I have never found myself praying to a god or gods when it happens.

Second, I would point out how horribly patronizing an attitude that comment is. What would that person's reaction be if I said "someday something bad will happen to you and you'll reject your god/come to the conclusion he doesn't exist?" He would probably take it as an insult to his convictions and faith. Well, I find the comment just as insulting.[1]

Thirdly, I could say the same thing with Allah/Zeus (or even worse, Satan) replaced to them.

There are so many things wrong with the statement that it is truly hard to know which way to isolate first...

There are so many things to say that it is hard to know where to begin.

Thirdly, I could say the same thing with Allah/Zeus (or even worse, Satan) replaced to them.

There are so many things wrong with the statement that it is truly hard to know which way to isolate first...

[1] I have for a long time felt that the main problem with proselitization is that it is, at a very basic level, fundamentally insulting. When someone finds out I'm an atheist and tries to proselitize, he/she is, in essence, saying that s/he believes my reasoning is faulty, that I have not thought about the question, or that I am ignorant about the question. Especially when, as is most often the case, they do not bother to find out ->why<- I am an atheist or how I arrived at my conclusions, or what my attitude is towards the question. In essence, they are saying that they think I am bloody stupid and ignorant, based on the fact that I am an atheist[2], and proceed from there. I find that the most insulting bit of it all.

[2] Mind you, there ->are<- atheists who are bloody stupid and ignorant, and who arrive at their atheism through ignorance or stupidity; I do not think there is anything inherently intelligent about being an atheist. It all depends on how you get to it. [1] I have for a long time felt that the main problem with proselitization is that it is, at a very basic level, fundamentally insulting. When someone finds out I'm an atheist and tries to proselitize, he/she is, in essence, saying that s/he believes my reasoning is faulty, that I have not thought about the question, or that I am ignorant about the question. Especially when, as is most often the case, they do not bother to find out ->why<- I am an atheist or how I arrived at my conclusions, or what my attitude is towards the question. In essence, they are saying that they think I am bloody stupid and ignorant, based on the fact that I am an atheist[2], and proceed from there. I find that the most insulting bit of it all. [2] Mind you, there ->are<- atheists who are bloody stupid and ignorant, and who arrive at their atheism through ignorance or stupidity; I do not think there is anything inherently intelligent about being an atheist. It all depends on how you get to it. (Arturo Magidin #257)

Usually I answer that they have no idea what I have already faced without turning to god. Occasionally I get into it.

"You mean like when your brother and mother almost die in a car accident two days before your 7th birthday and you spend the next ten years watching your mother go through painful surgeries to reconstruct her face?

Or maybe you mean when your best friends dad molests you and you finally get up the courage to tell your mom and she doesn't believe you because she thinks ten year olds are liars?

Or maybe you mean being called names and having all of the other kids at school make fun of your mother because she looks like FRankenstein or some other monster popular at the time?

Or do you mean breaking up with your boyfriend and then having him rape you because you broke up with him before he got what he thinks he deserves? Or maybe you mean that it is your first sexual experience? And it would be an added bonus if his friends all followed you from class to class at school and threatened to make up things about you if you dared report it?

Are these the kinds of things you think will turn me to god?

Sad, isn't it that you assume that you need to turn to god when life is horrible? You would think that your god would be so wonderful that it would simply take all the good in the world to believe in him, not the bad. I would think that the bad would be reasons not to believe in god.

The premise is proof that god is for weak minded people who need something to grasp on to instead of reality. (ClaySkye #4)

No one ever said this to me, but it is an interesting question. What it seems to come down is that in order to believe in god(s) I need to be so overwhelmed with what's happening to me that I can't cope with life and as a result my ability to think clearly is impaired. Then, in typical grasping-at-straws fashio, I take refuge in irrational belief in an imaginary being. Whether or not this might in fact happen to me, I do not know. However, it is quite interesting to see the presupposition that belief in god requires dementia, which, in the scenario evoked by this question is brought on by inability to handle "something bad" happening to me. (Orhan Orgun #1867)

I'd just point out that I was a xian for most of my life until just a few years ago, and it was in fact a string of bad things that led me away from religion, not closer to it.

If I was feeling really sarchastic, I might inquire as to whether or not they've got new management up there... maybe someone that will get around to responding to the stacks of prayers cluttering his in-box? (Leo)

"My life has had plenty of bad things happen, and I've always wondered where God was to prevent those bad things from happening in the first place. I've long since given up believing that some mystical event will alleviate my problems; I can only plan ahead to prevent them and, if they happen anyway, deal with them sensibly and maturely. Praying would just be a waste of time.

"Besides, isn't it somewhat goulish of you to wish suffering upon me? Isn't it a bit grotesque of you to hope that I'll have a moment of weakness, so that you could overwhelm my common sense and personal convictions just to feed your own minority belief? God doesn't need to convince me in my weakness; anyone can torture someone into weakness and make him say anything. It's in times of strength and wholeness that God has to be convincing. "And he simply isn't." (Elf M. Sternberg #1493)

Click here to return to master question page.